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Thread: Carrier Deal

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    Default Carrier Deal

    It would appear that Trump has stopped Carrier AC's partial move to Mexico, saving around 800 jobs. Kudos to him if it sticks.

    I want to know what the deal was.

    Relaxing EPA regs or what. Had to be big as the building in mexico was about built.
    Elect a Clown You Get a Circus
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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Carrier is owned in part by United Technology Corp.
    UTC owns in part Pratt & Whitney Aircraft.
    P & W builds engines for the Defense Dept.

    If Carrier leaves, no defense contracts for engines!

    Bullying tactic or smart negotiation??

    (This is just a theory using my knowledge of the relationship between UTC and P&W and the business they do)
    Last edited by sundealer; December 1st, 2016 at 10:30 AM.
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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    To save jobs, carrot/stick or whatever it takes
    Elect a Clown You Get a Circus

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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Fastcar View Post
    It would appear that Trump has stopped Carrier AC's partial move to Mexico, saving around 800 jobs. Kudos to him if it sticks.

    I want to know what the deal was.

    Relaxing EPA regs or what. Had to be big as the building in mexico was about built.
    Quote Originally Posted by sundealer View Post
    Carrier is owned in part by United Technology Corp.
    UTC owns in part Pratt & Whitney Aircraft.
    P & W builds engines for the Defense Dept.

    If Carrier leaves, no defense contracts for engines!

    Bullying tactic or smart negotiation??

    (This is just a theory using my knowledge of the relationship between UTC and P&W and the business they do)
    Carrier has said it is concessions by the State of Indiana (Pence is the governor...how convenient, 'eh?) Hopefully this will work out good for the workers without hurting others in the process--dependent upon whether the "concessions" are going to cause others to pay more in taxes or somehow else take up the slack for what Carrier is getting.

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-1...-consideration

    ...
    However, shortly after the deal, questions emerged as to what the motive behind Carrier's decision may have been. Was Carrier pressured into doing a deal that was not in the best interest of shareholders of its parent, United Technologies? Was strongarming involved? Did Trump make a major concession as part of a political deal or did Carrier simply bend over backwards to appease the President-elect?

    We now know the answer: moments ago the company issued a statement in revealed that that real motive for the change in tactic was that "the incentives offered by the state were an important consideration" and quickly added that "this agreement in no way diminishes our belief in the benefits of free trade and that the forces of globalization will continue to require solutions for the long-term competitiveness of the U.S. and of American workers moving forward."

    What happens next? As some have suggested, it is a distinct possibility that this outcome may in fact backfire, and in order to extract the same "state incentives", US companies will proceed to announce comparable outsourcing arrangements in hopes that the Trump administration will approach them next in order to avoid the replacement of US workers with Mexcians, or other foreign nationals. It remains to be seen how the Trump administration will respond to such pressure from domestic corporations who may end up using their US workers as leverage to extract more concessions. .
    ...

    Has Trump and his organization brought all their manufacturing, or just any of them, back to the US? Surely not, or we would have heard it shouted from the rooftops.
    "...of no more satisfying conceit than the discovery of such hidden depths of character in one's own child..." - From Survive the Savage Sea
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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Quote Originally Posted by KathyInAR View Post
    Has Trump and his organization brought all their manufacturing, or just any of them, back to the US? Surely not, or we would have heard it shouted from the rooftops.
    Liberals complained that Trump was moving too slow on cabinet appointments but is actually ahead of past presidents.

    You want him not to be involved with his companies but you want him to bring those same companies back within weeks after being president elect.

    There is no satisfying liberals.

    Why not just go sit in the corner for awhile an see how things work out. Some of you continue to make fools out of your selves with your constant complaining.

    Didn't liberals say to conservatives when obama was first elected. "Give the guy a chance". Some said 1, 2 or 3 years to give obama a chance.

    More hypocrisy everyday. It's the way you win elections, right!
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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Gotcha View Post
    Liberals complained that Trump was moving too slow on cabinet appointments but is actually ahead of past presidents.

    You want him not to be involved with his companies but you want him to bring those same companies back within weeks after being president elect.

    There is no satisfying liberals.

    Why not just go sit in the corner for awhile an see how things work out. Some of you continue to make fools out of your selves with your constant complaining.

    Didn't liberals say to conservatives when obama was first elected. "Give the guy a chance". Some said 1, 2 or 3 years to give obama a chance.

    More hypocrisy everyday. It's the way you win elections, right!
    All
    he'd have to do is tell his kids, "do it!" Wouldn't take much effort on his part. I really find it rather funny how scared you seem to be of "liberals"...

    What liberals have complained that Trump was moving too slow on cabinet appointments? Any complaint I have heard or seen is some of those who he has considered or appointed, not the speed at which he did so.

    You really are quite funny when you try to compare the reactions of the left to Trump and the rights' to Obama. I can almost see you in my mind's eye, each time your type the word "liberal"...snickering like a little boy who has gotten away with saying a naughty word.

    Liberals can't hold a candle to conservatives/GOP when it comes to hypocrisy. The conservatives/GOP win hands down every time!
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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    http://www.aol.com/article/news/2016...deal/21618628/

    Bernie Sanders: President-elect Trump 'has endangered' American jobs with Carrier deal



    CHRIS ZOIS
    Dec 1st 2016 3:26PM

    Senator Bernie Sanders penned an op-ed in The Washington Post to criticize president-elect Donald Trump's recent Carrier deal. Sanders said the deal, which has now been revealed to hand Carrier $7 million in tax breaks over 10 years to keep 1,000 jobs in Indiana, "endanger[s] the jobs of workers who were previously safe in the United States."

    The deal with Carrier, a manufacturer of air conditioners and heating equipment for parent company United Technologies, will keep 1,000 jobs in VP-Elect Mike Pence's home state of Indiana. However, additional details are emerging. The Hill reports how 600 Indianapolis jobs will still move to Mexico, and the company will close a factory in Huntington (which will shift another 700 jobs to Mexico). As part of the deal, Carrier will be receiving $7 million worth of tax breaks over the next decade. Sanders says this deal does more harm than good for the American worker.

    Sanders writes that Trump has already compromised his campaign promises with this deal. Sanders went on to say this could set a dangerous precedent where companies could easily show a bluff to Trump, who could
    cave to their demands:

    "Trump has endangered the jobs of workers who were previously safe in the United States. Why? Because he has signaled to every corporation in America that they can threaten to offshore jobs in exchange for business-friendly tax benefits and incentives. Even corporations that weren't thinking of offshoring jobs will most probably be re-evaluating their stance this morning. And who would pay for the high cost for tax cuts that go to the richest businessmen in America? The working class of America."


    Sanders points out that United Technologies is not in the red as it made $7.6 billion in profits in 2016. But ultimately, the Bern wants to look out for the working class in this post-election setting. He'll surely be keeping an eye on Trump for years to come.
    "...of no more satisfying conceit than the discovery of such hidden depths of character in one's own child..." - From Survive the Savage Sea
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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Quote Originally Posted by KathyInAR View Post
    All
    he'd have to do is tell his kids, "do it!" Wouldn't take much effort on his part. I really find it rather funny how scared you seem to be of "liberals"...

    What liberals have complained that Trump was moving too slow on cabinet appointments? Any complaint I have heard or seen is some of those who he has considered or appointed, not the speed at which he did so.

    You really are quite funny when you try to compare the reactions of the left to Trump and the rights' to Obama. I can almost see you in my mind's eye, each time your type the word "liberal"...snickering like a little boy who has gotten away with saying a naughty word.

    Liberals can't hold a candle to conservatives/GOP when it comes to hypocrisy. The conservatives/GOP win hands down every time!
    I know you try hard to make this about me. I enjoy showing liberal hypocrisy. Ah yea, I would think with the many investments he has around the world it may take a little more then what you suggest. After all he works for a living and he was no community organizer tthat had little to give up.

    Complaints were fairly common from sources such as NYT, ABC, MSNBC, CNN etc. I heard it and it's pretty easy to google.

    If I'm
    "scared" as you say of liberals why then would you think I was "snickering like a little boy"? Can't have it both ways.

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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Guess he couldn't figure out how to organize them.

    I found a preacher who spoke of the light but there was brimstone in his throat
    He'd show me the way according to him in return for my personal check
    I flipped my channel back to CNN and I lit another cigarette

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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    thank pence for giving state tax incentives to carrier, thank trump for attaching his name to ford for not moving some operations to mexico, hes bullshit so far.some believe his bs
    Last edited by slick; December 2nd, 2016 at 09:01 AM.

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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Last edited by KathyInAR; December 2nd, 2016 at 08:53 PM.
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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    "...of no more satisfying conceit than the discovery of such hidden depths of character in one's own child..." - From Survive the Savage Sea
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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Quote Originally Posted by KathyInAR View Post
    She is, in a lot of ways correct, on this imo.

    When you move past the emotional and real joy of saving these jobs, you have to ask,what was given up, what is the true cost of this long term?

    There is no such thing as a free lunch when dealing with big business. It is all about the bottom line.

    The more I think about this, I have a ton of questions and doubts.
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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Fastcar View Post

    She is, in a lot of ways correct, on this imo.

    When you move past the emotional and real joy of saving these jobs, you have to ask,what was given up, what is the true cost of this long term?

    There is no such thing as a free lunch when dealing with big business. It is all about the bottom line.

    The more I think about this, I have a ton of questions and doubts.
    Yes,
    I know...that's why I found it funny...well, that and that Trump is/was considering her for a cabinet position.

    It seems as if one person's job being saved costs another person their job...doesn't seem like progress to me...besides costing the taxpayers $7,000,000 in the process. Cronyism to be sure! A bribe to make it look as if he was successful at something...wonder how much more of this we are going to see???
    Last edited by KathyInAR; December 3rd, 2016 at 10:31 AM.
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  15. #15
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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Quote Originally Posted by KathyInAR View Post
    Yes,
    I know...that's why I found it funny...well, that and that Trump is/was considering her for a cabinet position.

    It seems as if one person's job being saved costs another person their job...doesn't seem like progress to me...besides costing the taxpayers $7,000,000 in the process. Cronyism to be sure! A bribe to make it look as if he was successful at something...wonder how much more of this we are going to see???
    Looking at from a workers point of view you always welcome the guy on the white horse.

    But what if your waiting and the white horse doesn't happen for you?

    What if the company is doing massive lay offs? Does he offer incentives?

    What about labor contracts? There are usually protective agreements that come into play.

    There is the legal system, the NLRB and so on.

    What if it is a friend of Trump who is the CEO? Does he involve himself there as well.

    He's the going to be the PRESIDENT! As such he can't be involving himself in corporate decisions no matter how objectionable they are.

    This is going to become a very slippery slope imo.
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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Trump has never seen any reason why he should or is required to play by the rules.
    "...of no more satisfying conceit than the discovery of such hidden depths of character in one's own child..." - From Survive the Savage Sea
    Integrity is doing the right thing when no one is looking.

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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    How much was invested in Solaria?
    Car manufacturing?
    I found a preacher who spoke of the light but there was brimstone in his throat
    He'd show me the way according to him in return for my personal check
    I flipped my channel back to CNN and I lit another cigarette

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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    hey lady, do you know apples----oranges?
    Likes KathyInAR, Fastcar liked this post

  19. #19
    Piney-Woods Rooter

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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    Quote Originally Posted by sundealer View Post
    How much was invested in Solaria?
    Car manufacturing?
    Don't know about solaria.

    The auto jobs?

    Here at Carrier we are talking about 1000 jobs.

    The auto industry is huge. Here's a little info for you.

    Every 10th job in this country is linked to the auto industry.

    Here's another. The money was paid back. Except for Ford. Ford didn't take any money

    And what is your point??
    Elect a Clown You Get a Circus

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    Default Re: Carrier Deal

    "Solaria (spelling?) was to develop alternative fuel sources, not related in any way to what the Carrier deal is.
    "...of no more satisfying conceit than the discovery of such hidden depths of character in one's own child..." - From Survive the Savage Sea
    Integrity is doing the right thing when no one is looking.


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